But I realise now what happened. I was only for about a week to 10 days on that Discord and still tried to figure out how it worked. I shared a lot about my experience with Pret, grief etc.
At one point I mentioned and linked to that I worked with the BBC, Once I mentioned this, Cliff became weird. He seemed angry, irritated, constantly “asked” me questions that weren’t questions but rather QUESTIONING and criticising me. His vibe was just off.
He also constantly pushed his writings up the list so his page is always on top. At one point he mentioned that someone he admires recommend him. I didn’t really check it out as he started to become weird.
And then the whole Facebook debacle. My Substack got suspended which 1. I’m sure he’s behind it and 2. doesn’t matter because I had no subscribers and the page was stagnated most of the time. I’m sure he’s coming after anything he can find as he showed stalker-like “qualities”.
He also just minutes ago left a comment on the above post with a link to a website but I trashed it already and will find out how to block him on WordPress. This shows his audacity and how narcissistic he is. He thinks of himself too highly, typical narcissist. He probably enjoys the attention. It’s attention he gets, it’s exposure and in case his stalking continues, there are the receipts.
I am not one to speak in this kind of way of that people are “jealous”. But from the moment on when I mentioned my work with the BBC and linked to other press articles that I influences direct or indirect, he became weird. That’s when it all started. Because before that, he followed me and recommended my writings. But SUDDENLY, that stopped he asked weird questions that felt invasive, even somewhat aggressive.
He’s an older guy and spends all day online. And writers usually don’t get along well with other writers like musicians and actors do. There’s ofyen this competition and insecurity between writers. It seems he felt threatened. Poor dude.
Here again just one of the several DMs/mails I got about this creep.
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Well put into words.
Anyway, I think the penny dropped now on what happened and why he became so patronising and creepy. There seems to be more than a hint of grandious narcissism, certainly insecuritythere. But that’s for him to figure out. Glad I don’t have to see his bulls!t anymore.
Not going to write any further about this guy. I receved some DMs and mails about him, and I’m glad this happened early on, and not if I was on Discord for a year being in this toxic environment. Yuck.
If you want to avoid all the screenshots (receipts), please scroll down to underneath the large red writing “Text for AI Audio Reading”.
The following people are key to the creep CliffSongs being able to behave like he does: The only “official” moderator (?): Lynne McCartney
Vida86, Ellen Pepper, and Ppekka98.
UPDATE and upfront:
I have received several messages on Discord and via my website that this Cliff guy I write below is off the wall. And the only moderator, Lynne, is all in on it.
Just 1 of several messages from people:
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I had a very creepy conversation if I can call it a “conversation” with a guy (CliffSongs) who uses the same Discord server for writers from the now closed Post.News site. The site was a news site which was still new but, even the likes of journalist Rachel Maddow was on there with quite a large following. For some reason the site got closed but there’s an invite link to a Discord server, so I joined it.
There are writers of different genres who used to have accounts like I did on Post.News. One of the writers is a guy named Cliff who posts poetry. I mention him publicly because he writes publicly, including on my Facebook post.
When I started on Discord around the beginning of June 2024, mentioning my writings and experience with Pret, we had a normal exchange and we started following each other on Substack. Other writers also followed on Substack.
The Discord chat was always regular with all sorts of subjects from politics to sports to writing etc.
Cliff always seemed a little suggestive and asked questions that I felt weren’t real questions, but as if he was trying to lead to something he might conclude later. But I just swept it aside.
Some of the questions I just didn’t respond to. Questions like “how long ago did all this happen” … the issue with my brother dying and Pret etc. I always felt that he asked this to then say to me to move on. The way he asked it had this sense of they weren’t real questions out of interest. And he kept pressing those questions that I responded with clear words that it doesn’t matter when what happens because trauma doesn’t know time until it heals. So, I left these questions unanswered.
Or he’d say I am repeating myself when I re-posted a YouTube link or something to someone, as I either forgot I posted it or posted it to another person who wasn’t there at a previous chat.
From then on he never directly responded to me in the chat as before. Which was perfectly fine with me. It felt already a little creeped-out, but as long as I didn’t interact directly, why should I get suspicious of a weird communication. But I think he was not happy that I refused to answer his “questions” and that I was unimpressed with him.
And then suddenly I have a public comment on an old post from 2018 on Facebook. But the comment was simply “Hi”.
I have had many private messages from guys on Facebook simply writing “Hi”. Those messages, no matter if private or public are weird to me. But as I always respond to every PUBLIC comment out of courtesy, even to the rude ones, I responded (I compiled the screenshots here below).
But as usual, Cliff wrote weird and it started to turn creepy pretty quick, more direct and patronising on Facebook which he never dared on Discord where all the other writers (about 6 or more at any given time) wrote as well.
On a side note, I also can’t figure out why there is the “send message” appearing on his comments as I haven’t seen this before on FB posts, or I haven’t noticed it. But it felt that he wanted me to private message him. I don’t know.
Keep in mind this is an old post of mine from 2018, not easy to find unless you search or use certain search words doing a deep dive. And this is what I mentioned to him as a “deep dive” into my FB posts. There’s another comment by a lady but that’s from 2018 when I posted the link to my blog.
When you follow the timeline of the “conversation” later on Discord as well, it’s clear he was trying to wriggle me into some weird conversation and rabbit hole of his. But I refused from the start. He has this weird way of writing on the Discord chat, but on Facebook it became very creepy very quick.
I highlighted in yellow a few things that I find really creepy, this is the way he did NOT write publicly on Discord where others read, but publicly on Facebook on a SIX YEAR old post which no-one would find unless they do a deep dive.
I will put all the screenshots first and then the text underneath for people with visual impairment. I do screenshots in case he deletes his posts even though I blocked him now on FB.
On the top right of the comments where it says “Most relevant” click to “All comments” otherwise some comments are hidden. And then keep clicking “View previous replies”, “Show more” etc. to get the FULL interaction. Facebook doesn’t show all messages and you have to constantly click to open comments.
Judge for yourself, but the following is textbook gaslighting, creepy, manipulative and started to border on stalking all at once.
I linked my blog, podcast, substack etc. to the Discord chat last week. And I’ve experienced that when people listen, especially to my podcast where I show vulnerability, it draws the creeps. I mentioned later tonight on Discord that I might appear vulnerable, but I don’t mess with my boundaries getting crossed.
I had to pretend to be happy and strong for years in Pret (research Pret’s micromanaging fear management via weekly mystery shoppers). And with all the losses and bullying, I neither want to nor have the strength to show a fake persona. I speak from my gut, which occasionally shows vulnerability. Some men don’t get the message, they think someone, especially a female, sounds vulnerable or instable, and they start to get creepy, claiming “friendship” after a week on a Discord chat. Shudder! Brrrrrrrr ……
The moderator, Lynne McCartney, later deleted the comments except her request to chat in private, She seems to protect him and also disregards my request for me not to communicate with him in private message. After I posted publicly on Discord, he private messaged me which I declined to open and declined to engage in private. I have to count the times he refused to respect my requests.
Some of the times overlap in the screenshots below, and I didn’t separate, like the timing I asked him publicly on Discord to NOT communicate on Facebook nor private message, and him then saying that I “established” to not private message, therefore he established to communicate on FB despite repeated requests not to.
Just a brief recap:
I asked Cliff on FB and later on Discord (always publicly) to NOT communicate on Facebook, but on Discord and to not communicate on private message, as his comments started to get creepy like I’ve never seen anywhere on the socials. As he was so creepy on my PUBLIC Facebook post, he’d be worse in private message while wanting me to remove my public request to him on Discord! It’s clear how creepy this is. .
He wanted me to delete my comments on Discord, which I declined as his Facebook comments are public. .
He then started to really get patronising and said on Discord that he blocked me (I assumed on Facebook as I wasn’t and still am not blocked on Discord), calling me “kid” and “prat” (I use “Prat” for Pret which he saw on my blog and Discord forum posts. .
But he did NOT block me on Facebook and instead decided on my behalf that I wanted to communicate on Facebook after I repeatedly said no comms on FB. Here’s where the creepiness really “blossomed” and it started to feel “stalky”. .
He also claimed that he blocked me on Discord which isn’t the case at the time. I mentioned that I’ll unsubscribed which you can do on Substack. .
I blocked him on Facebook and informed him of it on Discord. .
Then the mod deleted my and Cliff’s comment exchange asking me to private message with him which I repeatedly said I wish not to do with him. .
Here come the screenshots. Press ctrl & + to enlarge and ctrl & – to decrease again if you don’t have a touch screen to enlarge the screenshots. I try to put all the text under the screenshots for people with visual impairment. I post screenshots as “receipts”.
See the rabbit hole of a psychological game and gaslighting he tried to pull me in. Note his communication style, always sounding “mysterious” as if to come across special or as someone you want to get to know, but this has the opposite effect and is creepy as hell. And in hindsight, as I put this together it seems to me that he just craves attention. But that’s not the way to do it, dude.
The comments were on my 2018 Facebook post linked to my blog post and him just commenting “Hi” with nothing further, which I ALWAYS find creepy, no matter if in private or public messages.
UPDATE: It all makes sense now, this Cliff guy who constantly pushed his own writings at the top of the forum has issues with my writings and the strength I presented in the chat. He thought to creep in with the support of the only moderator Lynne Mc. This is just a typical clique dynamic who get insecure when a strong voice enters the room.
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He jumps straight into being “friends” after knowing my writing since around a little over a week, and fishing for a defense response, saying there’s no point to what I write. Classic attempt to gaslight. He does it on high speed, while on Discord not even speaking to me directly anymore after I didn’t answer his questions last week.
Now imagine how he would write in a private message!
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Typical gaslighting by a person, a man who doesn’t take “no” for an answer trying the old trick in the book: “That’s not being friendly” because I draw boundaries, trying to guilt-trip me. And then “Perhaps you’re havng a bad day”. What a joker! Classical way to try and make someone, especially whom he knows to be female, feel guilty that his little male ego got put in its place! He picked the wrong one!
“Yes, you appear to be having a bad day. I’ll give you some time to collect your thoughts.”
Old school, man to a woman, “You’re being hysterical, have you taken your medication”. OLD SCHOOL! 😀
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Take notes, gaslighting by the book:
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Typical type of male who shows insecurity and being upset that I don’t fall for this crap, trying to manipulate “You’re not nice to me … that’s not being friendly … why so unfriendly … that’s not being kind …”
To all women out there and train your girls: STOP being nice, stop being “kind” to creeps. Respect your own boundaries and protect them! Don’t let a creep and his enablers fool you to be nice when he disrespects your boundaries! Creeps will NOT respect your boundaries until you put your foot down! Move away from him if necessary, block him, report him … but you don’t need to be nice or kind! You need to be kind to YOURSELF and children who are truly vulnerable and in need of empathy and fierce protection!
Side note, also see my Samaritan post regarding women being coerced to save men on the edge of the train platform.
Creeps always try to test and then cross boundries with above manipulative type slogans, “you’re not being nice … that’s not lady-like …” Old fashioned creepiness and male entitlement trying to get the upper hand. Shudder again!
And now due to chronologial order (more or less) I started repeating publicly on Discord to respect my request. And here he now becomes openly rude, trying to offend me and requesting me to delete my comment, to no avail mind you. The mod later deleted, probably upon his request, and it seems she supports him. Fine with me, I’m used to coming up against a group of people (looking at the devil that is Pret).
Press ctrl & + to enlarge the screenshots, I didn’t include all in below text as a lot are repeated requests by me to not use Facebook or private DM with Cliff.
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Back to Facebook towards the bottom where he now blatantly manipulates. There’s so much blatant disrespect and borderline stalking that I don’t know if to laugh or be concerned. Mind you he’s more controlled on Discord, but blatant on Facebook. He doesn’t appear drunk or in distress. And again with what he writes on a public Facebook post, imagine how he would write in a DM!!!
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I then blocked him on Facebook, but not on Discord, as he isn’t creepy on Discord like on FB because there are other readers there compared to the old FB post.
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Back on Discord where this whole saga ends. I immediately take screenshots as my and Cliff’s comments have been deleted, I knew any more comments would get deleted. But I keep “receipts”.
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The mod now deleted comments and requests for me to private message with Cliff, which seems to be his plan all along. Again, no respecting of my requests and of boundaries. The mod of course keeps HER post public while deleting my response to her request. I keep receipts.
It seems to me like Cliff asked the mod to delete the posts and for me to communicate with him in private, which he seemed to have wanted all along. And she accommodates that for him.
She contacted me early after I started Discord and accidently created a 2. account and she asked me which account I want deleted and if I really want a long name etc.
I told which account to delete and only then found that Discord allows multiple accounts. So, I’m wondering why she gets involved in my affairs of having 2 accounts which is allowed on Discord. In hindsight, it felt invasive, as if to tell me what to do?
But they’re certainly a team and don’t seem to (want to?) get what I’m saying with Cliff’s creepiness.
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The mod then moves my last comment into DM and I briefly explain that upon her suggestion for me to block Cliff on Discord, that I don’t need to block him on Discord compared to Facebook, as he behaves differently on Discord as there are people reading. Remember, my FB post is from 2018 which no-one will find unless they do a deep dive like Cliff did.
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Text for AI audio reading
From Facebook. Cliff Lake will be shortened to CL and my name shortened to ExP. When I saw “Hi” with no further text I was already in this “Here we go” mode, as I received many private messages from guys in this way when my Facebook was still under the name “late night girl” and I saw the suggestive profiles of the senders, but I immediately blocked.
But I also get weird private messages after people hear my podcast and think I’m this vulnerable damsel in distress they can patronise. As I knew this Cliff is from Discord I responded and always respond publicly, even to openly rude comments.
I won’t highlight anything like I did in above screenshots to keep the flow and let the readers see the creepiness in his comments. I only add some things in italics. The convo starts on 12. June 2024 after 10pm and stretches out until late 15. June 2024 with the mod comments early 16. June 2024.
To me there is nothing straight forward or normal in his communicating, it’s all about asking weird questions, gaslighting, trying to be “mysterious” to make me ask questions or throw me off of what he means, trying to drag me into a web of confusion or even self-doubt. It’s so classic. Some comments are made by the same person, either him or myself twice in a row.
Start of the comments verbatim:
CL: Hi
ExP: Hi Cliff, you must have done a deep dive on my facebook. I completely forgot about the above writing challenge on WordPress.
CL: Much can be seen if one knows how to look.
ExP: I know. My blog has become so big as in so much text that I have to use the search button on my own writings. Was there a specific reason you just say “Hi” on a facebook post? People usually make a comment, good or bad, but “Hi” is quite unusual.
My posts, blog etc. are all public, I write straight out and people can search and find anything.
CL: Just like I found this post. I assume I that is the point you are making.
ExP: What point is that?
CL: That I found your post. ” I write straight out and people can search and find anything.” Perhaps you can inform if I have misread the point you attempted to make.
ExP: No point Cliff. I write on Pret A Manger and other things, nothing more nothing less. Have a good weekend.
CL: Now I understand. There’s no point to what you write. Thank you.
CL: Just a little joke between friends.
ExP: Hey Cliff, not sure what game you’re playing, but please play it elsewhere. And not sure why you’re so talkative with me here while not on Discord. I have no time nor interest in any games. Please respect that. Thank you.
ExP: We’re not friends, I don’t know you, and I’d prefer to communicate on Discord, not on facebook. Thank you.
CL: That’s not being friendly. Perhaps you’re having a bad day.
CL: Game? I’m not playing a game. Yes, you appear to be having a bad day. I’ll give you some time to collect your thoughts.
ExP: Sorry Cliff, but you come across creepy. Please respect my request to communicate on Discord, not on Facebook.
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Now I’m starting to write on Discord where others can read, which of course he doesn’t like and then asks me to delete, which I decline until the mod later deletes everything related to the FB issue. See how bluntly rude he immediately gets on Discord calling me “prat”.
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Discord ExP: Hi Cliff, could you please respect my request to not communicate on facebook, but rather here? Thanks.
CL: Please remove this post and communicate in private. Thank you, prat.
ExP: The communication is not private. The communication is public on my public facebook post.
CL: Please remove this communication and refer this conversation to DM. Thank you, prat.
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He then private messaged me on Discord, but I declined and continued in the public chat. There was an ongoing refusal to respect my request to not wish to private message.
Always be aware or remember that those who are creeps or acting creepy want to ISOLATE you into a private space. He picked the wrong one. And if the mod wouldn’t have deleted the posts, I would not put all this this on my blog. But for my protection and to show how creepy conduct works, I post it all here.
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ExP: I don’t communicate in private. You commented in public on my public fb post and not saying that you “are”, but it comes across “creepy” and patronising, therefore I asked to stop communicating on Facebook, and I have no wish to communicate in private and ask to respect this.
CL: Welp, you’re blocked, kid. See ya in the funny papers. (No idea what he means by “funny papers”)
Exp: That’s ok. I already unsubscribed (from his Substack)! Please respect when people have a request. It’s for online safety. Thanks.
Back to Facebook in the timeline where he becomes more blatant and creepy, completely disregarding what I’ve just said on Discord minutes before. I also linked the Facebook post into the Discord chat for others to see mainly for my protection but also to show Cliff that he picked the wrong one to gaslight.
Again, he hasn’t blocked me on Discord, because we kept communicating on Discord and I still see his regular posts to others on Discord and could reply to him. He CLEARLY wanted to communicate OUTSIDE of other readers seeing what he does. And HE decides that we WILL now communicate on FB after I clearly stated several times not to.
Right from the Creep-Playbook, and further where it starts to sound like “stalking”:
CL: Now. let’s talk about how friendly we have been. Since you’re blocked on Discord, here is where we will communicate.
CL: Now that you’ve established that you do not communicate in private, let’s learn to be friends, prat. to wit: “I don’t communicate in private and I have no wish to communicate in private and ask to respect this.”
After this I blocked him on FB and wrote my last comment on this guy.
ExP: Ok, I blocked this Cliff guy now. Not sure why he doesn’t respect boundaries. He appears creepy and patronising. When men don’t respect requests and boundaries … He claims I blocked him on Discord while he claimed he blocked me (on Facebook?). (I mistook that he said he blocked me on Facebook instead of Discord – although I’m not blocked on either).
I continued briefly with the mod after she deleted the comments, and that was that. I can predict what’s going to happen next, as the mod seems to support this guy.
Now dear reader, on a scale of 1 – 10, what’s the creep-level here? To me it’s quite up there!
Thank you for reading.
expret.org
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UDATE already minutes after I posted this blog post, as Cliff knows that I unsubscribed from his Substack, he or someone affiliated with him (as all from that Discord have now unsubscribed from my Substack) must have reported a post on my Substack, as my Substack now got taken off public view. He has more followers, and people with more followers or a clique around him often report small accounts when they’re upset or feel rejected.
Bring it on, I already predict what’s gonna happen on Discord. 😉
This guy thinks I’m stupid.
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First of all, I don’t give a flying fnck if I get reported or shut down. I don’t have have all my eggs in 1 basket, and losing social media accounts means nothing to me. I have all my important connections and support via email and in real life, not on social media or other platforms.
Second, I have not posted anything in 2 or 3 days and post very little, as well as never private messaged anyone before having gotten made invisible. So, the spam allegation is a generic bot and it’s clear, this is a retaliation for me setting boundaries and then unsubscribing from, and blocking Cliff’s Substack. *Yawn*
UPDATE 16. June 2024 – my Discord account has now also been suspended. But some people come my blog and contact me here even before I was suspended because they’re being reprimanded by “certain” people in the clique to not engage with me. Too late. 😉
The reporting to get shut down is very, VERY typical and common on social media everywhere, and is very childish immature behaviour, calling mummy or daddy to send the other person to the naughty corner because my ego got hurt and I was told “no”.
Others from the Discord chat who subscribed to my Substack also unsubscribed from me. I can still login and see my followers and those I’ve subscribed to, and those are not on this Discord server. So, this seems a “clique-ish” thing and is also nothing new under the sun.
Happens a lot on YouTube as well, where large accounts with millions of followers get upset at someone who has 20,000 followers. And social media mostly, if not always, sides with the larger account. It’s become so common, people stop to care and spread out across many platforms. Don’t have all your eggs in 1 basket, is the old wisdom.
Also, people often report someone TO Facebook when they got upset at a person ON Twitter. But FB has nothing to do with Twitter / X! It’s just really childish, sulking and toxic retaliation behaviour.
Cliff will be told about this blog post of course, and the aim will be made to report me everywhere possible. A little reminder, when you post a PUBLIC post, it’s forever on the Net, no matter if it’s deleted or not. You chose to post publicly. Own up to it. People can report all day long, that’s what larger accounts do all the time to smaller accounts when their ego is hit. Nothing new under the sun.
I came up against a multi-billion dollar company and lost my family, do you think I give a flying fnck about being reported, my accounts locked or suspended? 😀
Get over yourself, have a cup of Camomile tea. Grow up and respect boundaries, otherwise you act creepy or are a creep. Stop being creepy!
And to anyone reading this, especially women, DON’T get lured into private message by being made to feel guilty or made to be “kind”. Don’t be made to feel guilty for setting boundaries! SET BOUNDARIES, speak out, say “no”, say “stop”, block, shut the door, report … whatever you need to do.
When YOU feel uncomfortable with a person, respect your instinct and set boundaries without shame!
Do NOT feel bad about it! Let them report and try to get you shut down! It doesn’t matter, that’s what creeps do when they are told “no”. Show the creep the door!
Respect yourself and your boundaries, because no-one else will if you don’t. Many men are not used to this, when women draw CLEAR boundaries, but that’s THEIR problem, not yours! Life is too short for others to step all over you.
Be free! 🙂
*That’s a REAL smile, not a Pret A Manger mystery shopper required smile.*
Bullied during bereavement in Pret A Manger 
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